Low rising multi-grain

[A2Badger]

I have been using your multi-grain recipe on and off since taking your class a year ago.  Have never had the amount of rising we got there, though (the taste, however, is just as fabulous!).  Finally got a good scale, and I love using it.  But that means I'm out of good reasons for the poor rising.  My latest effort this weekend included adding 8 tsp of vital wheat gluten, and extra Tbsp of honey (to 4) and extra yeast (to 2 tsp).  Results are in photo.  Seriously, I'm considering keeping it all together to make one loaf.  All the ingredients are fairly fresh.  I am using Bob's Red Mill 10-grain cereal (I've also used their 7-grain cereal).  The only thing I always forget to do ahead of time is let the A2 water rest for several hours to let any chemicals come out -- but I don't think A2 uses chlorine so maybe that's not a problem??)

My notes from the class say that the grains will cut the gluten fibers, if proofed too long, but I have been generally using the timings in the recipe (I have at times gone longer to see if it will help -- it doesn't seen to).  I do throw water in the bottom of the oven at the start to help it rise further in oven.  Is it possible that Bob's grains are sharper than what you use?  Any other ideas?

[Alejandro Ramon]

Jim,

Thank you for your email.  I'm just getting back to work after having my right total hip replacement surgery.

I have a few questions for you about the fermentation of your multi-grain dough.

1.  Is the grain being soaked for at least 30 minutes?  The grains should break down as your kneading the dough and should be just barely noticeable in the finished baked loaf.  This process opens up the grains gluten which helps develop the dough strength.
2.  Is the mixture cooled enough before adding the yeast?  If the mixture is above 110 degrees it will kill the yeast.  Causing poor fermentation.
3.  Are you using bread flour in the recipe?  Or at least King Aurthur All Purpose.  The King Aurthur All Purpose has a higher level of protein 11.7 % and is closer to Bread Flour than other brands of All Purpose Flour.

Of course you are welcome to come by and I'll be happy do go through the process with you.  If you'd like to do this please let me know.  Please let me know if there is anything else you need.

Best,

Alejandro Ramon, BAKE! Instructor

[A2Badger]

Hi Alejandro,

Thanks for the reply.  Hope you're recovering well with the new hip.

I gave it another shot this past weekend after reading your reply.  It looked encouraging during the 1st fermentation -- it didn't double, but maybe 50% increase, which seemed slightly better than usual.  But it didn't seem to do too well after that.  I forgot to mention in my 1st post that my other breads rise just fine.  So the grains and how they are processed in the recipe seem to me to be the key.

To answer your questions, I am using bread flour, and the grain/boiling water is cooling down enough.  I've been using a touch test to make sure, and then mixing in the water next to be doubly sure I wasn't killing the yeast;  but this time I stuck a thermometer in it and it was just under 100, and under 90 after I mixed in the water.

This winter, I have not been soaking the grain for 30 minutes.  To speed up the process, I've actually been sticking it in the cold garage to cool down.  It does seem to cook enough, though, and it gets broken down well (I've eaten it as a hot cereal a couple times, and it seems fully cooked after 5-6 minutes).  But after reading your questions, I let it cool in the kitchen, and it did get 30 minutes this time.

Here are the ingredients in the Bob's Red Mill 10-Grain Cereal I've been using, in the order listed -- maybe there is something about this that might explain the poor rising:  whole grain wheat, whole grain rye, whole grain triticale, whole grain oats, oat bran, whole grain corn, whole grain barley, soy beans, whole grain brown rice, whole grain millet and flaxseed.

Thanks again.  Jim